Transcript

Intro: Broadcasting live from the Business RadioX studios in Houston, Texas. It’s time for Houston Business Radio. Now, here’s your host. Trisha Stetzel: Hello, Houston. Trisha Stetzel here bringing you another episode of Houston Business Radio. Today’s guest is Eric Mulvin, CEO of Pac Biz Outsourcing, where he built a 250 person remote team without outside capital. And we’re going to talk about that a little more later to. Eric’s company specializes in helping B2C e-commerce businesses scale with a powerful mix of human intelligence and AI tools, improving support, dispatch, and finance functions while keeping service quality at the forefront. He’s passionate about creating systems that allow leaders to delegate like CEOs lead effectively across time zones and protect a company culture, all while driving growth and client satisfaction. I’m excited to dive in to his journey of building and leading a global team the smart way. Eric, welcome to the show. Eric Mulvin: All right, Trisha, thank you so much for having me. And that’s an awesome intro. I’m going to have to write that down. That’s a great one. Trisha Stetzel: You can always come back and look at the recording, right? I’m just saying you can listen to the podcast. Well welcome. I’m so glad to have you on the show today, Eric. Um, when we had our initial conversation, we really connected. And I think there’s a lot of things that we have in common. I’d first love for you to tell the audience more about Eric. So tell us a little more about you. Eric Mulvin: All right. Uh, a little bit about me. Uh, I’m Phoenix guy, uh, Arizona native. Um, and if you know people from Arizona, you know that there’s not too many of us. Everyone here probably like Houston, Dallas, you know, those a lot of people from all over the place. Uh, yeah. And so, uh, that that’s a rare part of me, but I. I love being here in the desert. And I always knew that I wanted to start a business one day. I used to tell people that all the time. And, uh, there’s some really cool stories out there about some of the businesses that I started over the years. I just had no idea, as this entrepreneur, from building a Lego City when I was five years old and charging charging my parents admission. Um, my first business card I ever made for myself was in I think it was like sixth grade. I built a Kobe’s card Shaq basketball card, uh, where you could buy and sell cards for all the neighbor kids. And, uh, thanks to that, I’ve got some Kobe Bryant rookie cards that are locked away, uh, that are pretty valuable. Uh, but I’ve gone on and on and made a lot of businesses. I didn’t realize, though, that, uh, that was my career. I actually tried to go into marketing. Um, tried to. I was one of the first content creators out there in 2009, writing YouTube spots for, like, the Arizona Lottery, uh, casino Arizona out here, Arizona Department of Health and uh, then went on to Yelp, worked at that. Eric Mulvin: That was a Yelp as a startup. Uh, so that was a fun time. Um, and I took my last paycheck from that job and used it to get a loan for my first taxi, because I wanted to get into something I wanted I could disrupt. And being in college out here, uh, growing up, you know, I was I graduated college, like, 0708. Um, the taxi industry, that’s how you got home. If you were drinking at night, there was no Uber, there was no Lyft. And for those of you guys that remember what it was like back then, like everyone leaving the bar and there’s like how many taxis to take people home. So it’s a mess. You know, it’s a it was a broken system and no innovation for decades. And so I wanted to get into some place I could disrupt. And I was like, taxi, why not? So that’s what like was my first official LLC, my first business. And, uh, that got me into the entrepreneurship world. Um, but I should say really big important part of that story is nine days after I started the business, like I got the taxi. Uh, I met my wife. Uh, so we, like, there’s a crazy connection there. And she’s a business owner as well. So, um, but, yeah, that’s all part of the story. Uh, and then it kind of grew from there. Trisha Stetzel: Well, okay. So first, congratulations. So the two of you been together for quite a long time, and two, it sounds like there’s some serial entrepreneurship happening in the household. I’m just saying lots of that. Eric Mulvin: Yeah. Now starting to rub off on our kids, too. So, yeah, there’s definitely a house of, uh, entrepreneurs here for sure. Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, I love that. So let’s talk a little bit about Pac biz outsourcing. Tell me what it is. Uh, describe for the audience who you serve and why you serve them. Eric Mulvin: Yeah. So outsourcing, we provide 24 seven outsourced support to businesses across the US, Canada and the UK. Uh, and as Trisha mentioned earlier, we got a team over 200 people out there in the Philippines doing that work. And, uh, we focus primarily in, uh, transportation, e-commerce, uh, software companies. And, uh, we also have a virtual assistant division and that anybody could use. Um, but that’s, uh, pretty much what we do. And then being that, uh, we started it in 2015, uh, you know, I mentioned the taxi business, you know, Uber, Lyft, the whole thing changed. And so, uh, we pivoted to running a call center, uh, because we started the call center to take calls for ourselves. We had five people, um, working 24 over seven in the Philippines. And that’s what sparked the idea for the call center. And, um, from that 2015 to now, we’ve been able to grow it. And we’ve taken like, we’ve done some rough numbers, I think, for some back of the napkin estimates about 30 million phone calls at Pacages. Outsourcing is handled over the last ten years. Uh, and that’s a lot of experience. That’s a lot of data. That’s a lot of expertise there. And so we’ve taken all of that. We’ve learned over the last ten years. And now we’re building AI tools, uh, AI powered tools and software for the industries that we serve. Uh, and so that’s the, uh, 2.0 of Pacages that, uh, that we’re pivoting into. Trisha Stetzel: That is really cool. Okay. So, uh, I mentioned earlier in your bio that you actually built this team without any outside capital. So tell us the the secret to your madness over there. How did you get this built out? It sounds like it started with the taxi company and the need for having a team. And then you started building it so that you could support others. So how in the world did you get there without outside capital? Eric Mulvin: That’s a great question. And, uh, it’s, I guess one that I’m pretty fortunate that I because of the marketing and everything I was doing all these years. Um, I got connected with some people, some other business owners, and they really liked what, like what I was doing. Uh, and I actually, for one business owner, I was like, you’re spending TV ads, you’re doing radio ads. I was like, I don’t think you’re getting any results. So we cut about, I don’t know, is it $100,000? Out of his marketing budget? Sales stayed the same. So that was the moment where he was like, ah, whatever business you start, I’ll invest in you. Um, and so that’s what happened is, uh, he was one of the early investors in the taxi business, and then we, we stayed working together for the call center, and, uh, but we actually built it all from scratch. So we took all of the revenue that we created and put it right back into the business. And, um, we were able to grow everything from there. Uh, I look back and I, I didn’t realize how fortunate we were to be able to do that. I just thought, oh yeah, the business is growing. Let’s just keep taking money. Uh, lots of mistakes made along the way about budgeting and finances and and all that. But, um, but we’ve learned all those lessons, and we were able to, to scale it up to where we’re at today and, uh, but and that’s, that’s probably for another, uh, answer that, you know, what happens? How do you get to the next stage? Uh, because it, it, it starts to get very more challenging to continue to just bootstrap yourself, uh, as you want to get bigger and bigger and bigger. But that’s kind of how we got started. Trisha Stetzel: Okay. Yeah. And so why don’t we. If it’s okay, we’ll dig around in there a little bit. Uh, you know, what have been your biggest challenges in scaling? Eric Mulvin: Um, well, my business partner, who we’re 50, 50 partners with, um, I joined this this, uh, peer advisory group, uh, that was really beneficial to me. And because of that, I realized after that first session, uh, I went to him and I was like, I need to buy you out. Like, there’s really. You’re not really contributing anything here. Uh, and it was making the taxes a mess, and, uh, it’s just all kinds of stuff. So got him out of the business. And because I knew I could grow this to way bigger heights, and, uh, I was the one doing all the work, so that was part of it. Um, what are some of the other misses? I know being a business owner, you know, like, we I put my house as collateral, you know, for some of this, like, business loans that we ended up having to do over the last couple of years to, to get ourselves growing. Uh, and I think that’s a common thing that you hear business owners, uh, do as well. Um, definitely no credit cards. You know, we haven’t we didn’t build up, like hundreds of thousands of credit card debt, but, um, but I, I maintain really good credit history and, uh, good payment history, good reputation. Eric Mulvin: So I was able to go out and get some business loans and we, we built stuff up. Like what you hear a lot of businesses go through. You know, we got lines of credit so that we’re not relying on all this short term capital all the time. And that’s helped a lot now. And, you know, we’ve been able to pay off those loans. And now banks are like please it’s funny how that works right. Like when you need the money, it’s really difficult to get when you don’t need it. Everyone wants to give it to you. But we experienced that as well. So, uh, but we’re in a good spot. So if we want to grow now, uh, there’s, we have hardly any debt. And, uh, if I have a choice, I could take on money to to grow and accelerate the growth even faster. Or, uh, we could continue what we’ve been doing, build grow off of our own profits and grow from there. Trisha Stetzel: I love that, yeah, I heard someone say more than once, uh, the best time to get money is when you don’t need it, right? Or the best time to borrow money is when you don’t need it. Uh, because that’s when you’re prepared to get the money. Eric Mulvin: Exactly. Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. Uh. Let’s talk. You talked a little bit about human intelligence and AI tools and how you’re using those together in your business. So, um, how do you decide just at a high level, what to automate and what still needs human touch, and how does that work in your business? Eric Mulvin: Yeah. Uh, that’s another great question. You know, we’ve been working with AI tools now for, uh, well, at least at the leadership level, about a year and a half. Um, me personally, over two years. Uh, and I think it’s just because of the industry we’re in, you know, getting disrupted by AI. And so we jumped in sooner. Uh, a lot of you guys listening might be like, you know, it’s not really impacting my industry as much. And so you’re not seeing the pressure that we are. We’re like, hey, everything we’re doing in our call center could be automated by AI. We need to look at what else is out there. Um, but what we’ve done is we looked at what are the job like. We look at everyone’s role and we look at the tasks that they’re doing. What are the things that they could be doing that could be augmented, assisted by AI. And what are the things that could be possibly replaced by AI? And uh, and also what else could they possibly be doing if they’re not doing all these other things that now you’ve taken away from their plate? Uh, and so you go through that and you can do that with any role. Um, but doing that for your company is vital. And I think another step that was really beneficial for us is process mapping, and that you can’t skip that step. Eric Mulvin: And, uh, it it’s very time consuming, very laborious. But the dollar savings you get out of it, especially if you haven’t done it in a while for your business. Oh my goodness. Like the the money that’s leaking out of your company. Because people are just following a process. Just because that’s the way it was. They don’t question, you know, why is it the way it is? That’s a leader business leader’s job. And I think a lot of people don’t realize, like, how come people don’t think like me? Why don’t they see that glaring like hole in our process that no one has tried to fix? And it’s because not everyone thinks like a business leader, so they’re going to run through those steps over and over again for years until you actually sit down with the team, look at your process, be like, whoa, like this right here. We could totally put AI in this step and eliminate these steps over here. So you go through the whole process mapping and so you clean up your company, um, fix streamline things, but at the same time recognize here’s where we could put AI here and here. Uh, and so that that’s a very basic level, obviously, you know, this is months and months, sometimes years of work. Um, but that’s a high level overview of what to do. Trisha Stetzel: I love that. So and process mapping gets missed when we see solopreneurs or somebody who gets into business because they’re very passionate about a particular thing. And so they’re doing everything themselves and they don’t write any processes. So in the beginning, it’s bringing the team on. And now you’re in a position where you’re building these process maps with your team and implementing AI. I love that, I think it’s amazing. So we’re about halfway through our conversation. I know people are already interested in having a conversation with you, Eric. So what is the best way to connect with you? Eric Mulvin: Uh, best way to connect is on LinkedIn. You can find me on there, Eric, Marvin, and, uh, or, um, what’s another good place? Uh, our website Pac Pac biz com. Uh, and we are just, uh, at the time of recording today, we’re we’re rolling out a new website in the next 24 hours. Uh, really excited because all the stuff I’m talking about here, um, hasn’t been on our website yet, so, uh, there’s a lot of stuff about AI. We’re getting ready to do webinars, um, put out a lot of educational material and, uh, getting ready to launch my own podcast. So all that stuff, you can follow me and, uh, look for updates on there. Trisha Stetzel: It’s very exciting. I can’t wait to hear about your podcast. Okay. Uh. You guys. Eric. Mulvin. And it’s m u l v I n if you’re looking for him on LinkedIn, a great way to get connected again. Uh, CEO of PAC biz outsourcing. So. All right, Eric, let’s dig into you as a leader. Um, many business owners struggle to step out of the weeds, right? We’re so deeply embedded in our businesses. Uh, and you also serve people who are in the weeds and need to get out, right? So not just you, but the people you serve. What systems or even mindset shifts have helped you truly delegate like a CEO? Eric Mulvin: Oh, wow. Uh, I mean, I think one thing that I’m really grateful for is, uh, we got an outsource company, and that’s where you go to get virtual assistants. And so, uh, after years and years of people coming to me saying, like, do you have virtual assistant? I’m like, no, we just have to call center people, not virtual assistant. I finally like I better start looking into this. So I took one on first. And uh, for a couple of years I did that and I was like, this, this is amazing. I even just this week, um, the assistant that I have working with me now, shout out to man, in case you’re watching this, uh, but, um, we’ve been working together for over a year now, and I can’t tell you how amazing it is to have someone that you could throw any crap that’s coming your way to them and like, oh, there’s a conference coming up. I need to book. Book me for this and the travel. And we’re going to try to host a dinner. So contact the hotel and you know all that stuff. I don’t have to explain anything. I don’t have to, like, double check to make sure she booked the flight, okay? Because she’s booked dozens of flights for me. She knows. And, you know, we talked about, um, process mapping. We document every every time there’s a new task she has to do. It’s documented. And, uh. And if not, I can’t blame her for not doing it right. Eric Mulvin: We did take the time to document it, so. Alright, let’s do it right this time. And, uh, and so that whole thing has been so beneficial. We’ve been able to put all of that, that we’ve learned into, uh, our virtual assistant program. And the virtual assistant program is far from complete. Uh, because one thing I’ve recognized is business owners come to us at varying skill levels of working with an assistant and delegating. And so I know exactly the challenge that you guys are having. If you’re listening, like, I don’t know where to begin to delegate or I can’t delegate, none of that’s true. Everyone can delegate something. Um, there’s no way that there’s like you, your day is so filled up that you can’t pass things on to other people. Um, it’s just about control. And then creating the system so that you can get that stuff out. Um, and then another thing that I think has been Really beneficial as well. Um, is taking the time to get that assistant, um, some custom AI tools so that when they’re putting stuff together for you, whether they’re filling out like a description of your for a bio for some social media page or, you know, again, I, I use a conference example when you’re registering for a conference, give us details about your business. She knows exactly like he can create anything in exact words of how our business, uh, should should say it. Um, and in any of those processes are all in the AI tool as well. Eric Mulvin: So she can go to that for questions first before going to me. But even I built the tool where it’s like, what? Like what time of day I like to travel. Where on the airplane I like to sit, you know, if it’s a flight leaving in the afternoon from the Philippines, you know, when should I like? There’s all kinds of stuff in there that I know she can get. Right. And, uh, it also the accountability side is really interesting too, because when you give that I’m talking about virtual assistants, but the same thing applies to business owners and their employees. When they have that level of information. It’s not that you just verbally told them and they need to go do it. It’s like that AI tool has all the information you need to do your job, and if you’re not using that to do your job accurately, that’s a problem. Uh, so we give them those tools to, um, so that now I could just focus on running the business. And it’s taken a while to get to this point. Um, now we’re trying to see how can we bring that, the AI stuff to virtual assistant, because we’ve been doing that for years with clients. Um, we haven’t brought the AI side to it, so I’m really excited about that because that’s going to unlock so much more that a virtual assistant can do for business owners. And this is going to really help people accelerate faster. Trisha Stetzel: Yeah, absolutely. And you’re right about delegation. Some of us may be a little afraid of it, but it’s a learned skill. Not everyone’s good at it, and most of us aren’t in the beginning, right? It’s something we can learn. So go get good at it. And it can start with a virtual assistant. We have one to shout out to Risha. She’s been with us for three years this week and, uh, congrats. Yeah, it was a game changer. It was absolutely amazing. So as you are talking through that, I was thinking about leading across time zones. Uh, and many of us are doing that in our businesses, uh, or even as leaders in bigger corporations. And it can be tough to lead across time zones. So how do you maintain your company culture, uh, and, and even employee engagement when your team is spread across the world? Eric Mulvin: That is very true. Yeah. So the way we keep our company culture and engagement intact, you know, despite people working 24 seven all over the place. Uh, there’s a couple things. I mean, one really actually focus on culture. Uh, we have a full time person. We’ve had a director of company culture for many years, and we still have a full time person on the team that plans events. They recognize people on their birthdays. Uh, they they do all the fun stuff, uh, in their company. So if you don’t have anybody, if you’re a small company, right, like, hey, we six people. I can’t have a dedicated person. No, that doesn’t make any sense. But why not give someone that responsibility a couple hours a month? You know, a little bit of a budget. What would that do for your company? You know, and so, um, that’s, uh, that’s something that people can do. But how do we how do we manage the 24 over seven thing that that’s been something we’ve been struggling with? Uh, it’s been hard because, you know, we’ll have, uh, the bulk of our work is done daytime in the US. Um, so where we got a lot of people working, which is overnight in the Philippines, but our admin works daytime in the Philippines. So if they need to talk to some of the workers like it’s okay. Come in during the day. There’s been some issues, but we’ve been able to figure that we people in HR to work overnight. Eric Mulvin: So now there’s a meeting. Okay. You meet with this person overnight. Um, another thing. So we brought in a new COO. Uh, you know, I was earlier level company up. And how you do that. So in July, that’s a major change that we did. And one of the things that, um, she brought to us was a tool called asana. And so, no, I don’t have any promo codes for you guys. Pay me. But, um, just some, some management tool, and I know my wife is. She’ll be like, I’m telling you this for years that you need to get on like some to do list, but that in the last four weeks or so, like August is when we started putting that in place. It’s been because, like, we’re really trying to eliminate emails and meetings and everything into a sauna. And so that again, it’s a skill. It’s it’s taking time to learn. Uh, and getting everybody on board because you’re the way you’re doing your work is different. Um, but already we’re seeing drops like huge drops, number of meetings that has done, um. Emails are down, and, uh, but communication is. So we’re not spending more time in meetings. We’re not sending more emails. Um, we’re working more efficiently. So, uh, I think it comes back down to systems. It’s all systems in business. So, you know, you need a system to help you out with that. And, uh, that’s a good one to, to look at. Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. No, I love that. And I think that adopting tools that help us stay out of meetings and can keep us organized and create better communication with our teams is so important. Uh, earlier you talked about your VA service for anyone. And you know, the the language around using a virtual assistant is pretty well known. A lot of people know what they do. Let’s talk a little bit, just for a couple of minutes about the call center. Uh, you gave some examples of clients, but if someone’s listening and they may or may not know if they need a call center. Who are your best clients? And what is the benefit of having a call center? Eric Mulvin: All right. Our best clients, uh, would be. Well, there are bigger clients. We love those, of course, because if you come to us and they say we need 30, 40, 50 people. Yeah, that’s that’s amazing. Um, but we have these core values at practice. Uh, for us, it’s family, respect, teamwork, compassion and personal growth. And for whatever reason, that family one, um, it shows up in a bunch of different ways. One of them is a lot of our clients are family, business, family owned businesses, generational, multi-generational, like the grandparents started it 80, 90 years ago. Pass it on to their dad. And now they have. And now they’re trying to, you know, whether what how do you transform an 80 year old company into, you know, something that’s still viable in 2030? Um, but that gets us also working with smaller businesses, too. So some of the smaller. Well, obviously, if you have a virtual assistant, you just got one person working for you. Um, but we have some clients that have, uh, 2 or 3 people. So when do you need a call center? Well, it’s you one, you probably have a lot of calls, emails, chats, a lot of incoming stuff coming in. And you got someone from your team that’s doing that work. Now two things happen. Eric Mulvin: One is the person that’s doing all that work. They’re really good. And you want to give them more stuff, but you can’t because they’re busy with the customer stuff, and you’ve tried to hire somebody to take on customer service and everything. You not really representing your brand or you tried. They worked for a couple weeks and they quit. And now your your person is back to doing the same task again. These are the stories that we’re hearing from customers when they come to us. Uh, and so if you don’t want to deal with hiring, training, managing that person that’s doing the basic work, then that’s where we come in. So we could help with that. Uh, and then you focus on the parts of your business that matter. Uh, I don’t think anyone started a business to run a call center or to manage someone answering email, customer emails. It’s vital, but we can help with that. So that’s where we the experience, the support, all the people to do that. Um, then you could focus on your business. Um, so that’s the, the main thing that typically happens is that then. Yeah, maybe you already have some call center people and you’re trying to cut costs. Again, the having people here in the US, if you do great. Eric Mulvin: You know, and the people that do that I’ve seen be successful. They pay their employees a lot of money, more than, you know, minimum wage for the call center job. So if that’s not in your budget and not in your business model, We could be another solution because the people working in the Philippines. This is a white collar job for them. Many times they’re the breadwinner for their family. And when I say family, it’s not a four person household. It’s like a person household with the grandma, the brothers and some cousins all living under one house. And that person is usually the one making the money for everyone. So these are professionals. The issues that you deal with, people are working, working with people here sometimes, or I hear it from Canada, the US, the work ethic and some of the challenges there. They just don’t have that with the people in the Philippines. Uh, when you’re at least with the people we hire. Uh, so we really so whether it’s us or whether you’re working with anyone else, um, it doesn’t it’s not a magic wand to outsource. Oh, my problems are solved. There are. Even in our tiny city of 250,000 people, there’s like over 100 call centers, some of them having over 5000 employees. Eric Mulvin: And so there are tens and tens of thousands of options in the Philippines. And then even more so globally. So not everyone’s equal. You gotta look and make sure that the company you’re working with do they take care of their employees? Uh, are they happy? Do they stick around a long time? You know, we’ve been certified. Great place to work in the Philippines now from 2023, 2025. Like going on three years now. Uh, and we do that even though we’re a smaller company, most of them have like thousands and thousands of employees. But I want to show people like we really do take care of the staff, take care of the people there. And and it shows. I’ll, I’ll say this a long answer, but, um, we’ve been I, we have a new CEO. What typically happens in a company when there’s a new COO, there’s a lot of changes. People aren’t happy. Had some people leave and the last two, three weeks not even like the last week, I think it was like half a dozen people that have tried to come back to reapply. So I don’t know that that tells me something I haven’t dug into, like any interviews and surveys and what’s going on with that. But, uh, that’s that’s pretty interesting. Trisha Stetzel: That is very interesting. Well, and I love that you were able to just tell us your values. And one of those is family. And it sounds like whether they’re in the United States, Canada or across the pond, if you will, or across the globe, they’re all part of your family. And you, um, support family owned businesses as well. So I just I love that you were able to tell us that and you know exactly what your values are. And it sounds like everybody in your company understands that as well. All right. So as we get to the back end of our conversation, um, I have one last question for you, Eric. You talked about a few things that are kind of coming up the pike and things that you’re working on. But what’s next? What’s next for Eric and Pappy’s outsourcing? Eric Mulvin: Alright a lot. Uh, I was just listing out to my business coach, like the next couple of months. He’s like, what big projects are you working on? And, like, I ran out of room because there was so much. Um, we’re, you know, it’s all again. I’ll. I’ll tie it back to the story of leveling up. You know, we’ve been about the same size for the last 4 or 5 years. We hit the ceiling. Everything that I have tried to do to try to grow this company, going to conferences, doing more stuff on LinkedIn, spending a bunch of money on online ads, you know, like you’re just running around trying all this different stuff and like, something has gotta work. So finally last May, I was like, we’re just shutting down all of our marketing and we’re just going to figure out, like, who are we going to be? Because that was like for us, the peak of the freak out about AI, like, oh my gosh, like the news, the headline, it’s still now, today. But like then it really was like, okay, we really need to do something. So, um. So that’s where, like, now we’re getting ready to get a new website going. We got, uh, I’m launching a podcast, and then hopefully the next 30 days, it’s called Unfinished Business with Eric Walden. Eric Mulvin: Uh, interview people talking about what they’re doing with their business with AI and, uh, and outsourcing. Uh, and then, um, yeah, we’re getting ready to launch a bunch of webinars. So if any of the services I talked about sound interesting to you over the next 3 to 4 months, we’re going to have a webinar for every one of those, and we’re going to do that all the time. So, um, that’s another thing you could check out from our website. And then the big thing is our AI tools, like the, the first tool that we’ve been working on is a tool that listens to the calls and what we’ve figured out along this journey of like building a development team, um, building this for ourselves and now building for companies is that there’s so much more that you do like. Like for the people that are listening here, if you guys have ever had an AI tool on your meeting, on your zoom calls, you know the power of what that can unlock in your business. If you could take that transcript, you know, what can you do with it? With ChatGPT, you could do a million things for your business. Well, imagine the power of that for every single interaction that happens on the phone, because QA buy for call center, we typically if we’re talking to a company this week, they’re like, we’d be lucky if we’re listening to 0.25% of calls. Eric Mulvin: Wow. And, you know, we try to go for like 1%, but even then, that’s 99 point whatever percent of your calls. No one is monitoring. It’s completely of no idea. Most the time it’s like this bad thing happened. We need to go figure it out. Let’s go listen to the call. So what you can unlock from that is amazing. And it’s it’s taken this this simple tool that we thought we were building into something massive where it’s going to be able to do coaching for the people on the phones. It’s going to be able to lock in. That’s happening between, uh, in the transportation space, between the drivers and the dispatchers. Um, and then there’s, there’s a whole bunch more so that that’s the biggest thing. And we were we were talking with some pretty big folks in Europe, uh, that are probably going to be on board with us with the next couple of months. And so that’s crazy, like going from a call center to where we’ve got our own development team coming out with software. Uh, it’s I still can’t believe it. That’s the big thing. We’re working. Trisha Stetzel: Yeah. That’s amazing. Eric, it has been such a pleasure having you on today. So you guys go out to LinkedIn, you can find Eric Mulvin m u l v I n on LinkedIn. Or you can visit his website at Pacback. And find all of the cool things that he’s been talking about. Because I know the website is already out there. I’ll put all of these things in the show notes so you guys can just point and click as well if you happen to be sitting in front of your computer. Eric, again, thank you so much for being with me today. Eric Mulvin: Thank you so much. It was awesome being on here. And hello to everyone in Houston. Trisha Stetzel: That’s all the time we have for today. If you found value in this conversation I had with Eric, please share it with a fellow entrepreneur, a veteran, or a Houston leader ready to grow. Be sure to follow, rate, and review the show. It helps us reach more bold business minds just like yours and your business. Your leadership and your legacy are built one intentional step at a time. So stay inspired, stay focused, and keep building the business and the life you deserve.